If the Federation was actually post scarcity ...
DS9 Se: Ep 18: Profit and Loss.
Cardassian school teacher: I'm a good school teacher, but not much of a shuttle pilot. Can you repair it?
Chief O'Brief: This is an old model shuttle. We'll scrap it and replicate you a new runabout. It'll take about five minutes. Thanks for stopping by the station!
--- end of episode ---
I'm not entirely convinced the federation creates more per capita wealth than the US; they just distribute it a lot more evenly.
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I think the in-universe answer is that certain things, like power systems and computers, contain elements that for some reason can't be replicated. Like latinum.
ReplyDeleteFederation post-scarcity is just a super effective propaganda campaign. Also, I think anything based on the replicator tech is actually just black-box alien artifacts that no one /really/ understands.
ReplyDeleteMatt Johnson
ReplyDeleteWeyun: Are you one of those famed star fleet engineers who can turn rocks into replicators?
I think this is, like, star fleet engineering 101. The standard response is to replicate something new, or to build a replicator. It's only the realy advanced engineers -- like the Chief -- who can repair stuff.
I love the idea of the propoganda campaign. Got some awesome evidence for it?
There is plenty of inconsistencies in Next Gen and Voyager with just what is a limited resource and what isn't. I'm sure DS9 is no better but I haven't watched it for a long time.
ReplyDeleteHeh, mostly it was just a riff on your own comment.
ReplyDeleteMy memory is they handle the limitations of replicator tech well, with a few inconsistencies. I love how chill they are about it.
ReplyDeleteThe only way it’s hazy to me is how people in Starfleet engage in commerce on Deep Space 9’s Promenade.
Matt Johnson Nice. I also remember a delightful claim that the Federation is a protection racket, bringing in wealth to Earth, Vulcan, and (maybe) Betazed, while everyone else toils.
ReplyDeleteSo are you implying that the federation claims to be a post scarcity society by spreading food, while letting the children of wealthy vineyard owners joyride around the galaxy in a handful of superexpensive pleasure yachts?
ReplyDeleteSean Leventhal ... With a thousand people as the "officers", there to do whatever the elite "captain" orders them to. It's all a pyramid scheme.
ReplyDeleteThere's an old joke that petty officers do all the work -- we see one, Chief O'Brien. And he rarely talks about this post-scarcity lies.
We both literally lolled when we read your post.
Service Economy taken to excess... with a small number of goods that can't be easily replicated or which use certain rare materials or require huge amounts of time/effort or have property rights to their duplication assigned. Not completely post scarcity but a lot of common things are fakes (its not real earl grey tea, it's a bunch of chemicals that resemble it to the human taste buds and body mixed into water which is readily available thru recycling).
ReplyDeleteHeavy metals and their alloys, certain kinds of crystals, antiques and artifacts, are the raw materials that must be searched for. Drugs that can only be duplicated in specific environments, foods that contain organics no computer can replicate from raw proteins, organic materials (remember in voyager the living filter packs they used in the life support systems to cleanse/recirculate the air?) are the things that can't be just remade.
And then there are the controlled technologies (weapons weapons weapons).
Do Star Trek folks actually claim that they're post-scarcity? I thought they were just post-money, which is a different thing.
ReplyDeleteHonestly I'm not even sure they are post money given all the services for sale at ds9. I think it is more that their pseudo military vessels don't use money expressly and obviously.
ReplyDeleteBajor for sure isn't post scarcity.
ReplyDeleteThere's a good case to be made that the Federation itself is post-currency internally but that it's citizens have to deal with places where currency is still used. Which makes for a complicated system, honestly.
ReplyDeleteThere's also actual books on the subject of trek economics.
medium.com - The Economics of Star Trek – Rick Webb – Medium
I've heard that before, too, Matt Johnson: Post-money but not post-scarcity.
ReplyDeleteInstead of collecting dollars, they collect mastering ancient classics. Which is why Picard is a Captain -- his social score is high.
... wait, that might actually fit.
... is the federation a caste system based on reading and writing books, using skilled labor to make wine and gumbo, and inherited standing?
William Nichols I can't think of anything in the shows which doesn't fit that description.
ReplyDeleteExcept maybe that all admirals are uncultured old people with zero imagination.